Rules Questions thread

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Can someone please give a reasoning for this:
Q: Rules Questions thread - #205 by PointyFinger
A: Rules Questions thread - #207 by Barrelfish

In general, leveling up changes the “printed” stats of a Hero, right?
Is there a ruling which says that a Hero’s stats do not change when leveling up, if previously set by an effect?

Thanks.

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The reasoning here is that Chaos Mirror applies a temporary effect that overrides the base printed attack of the hero. Leveling up the hero may increase its base printed attack, but the Chaos Mirror effect is still active, and so it still overrides the printed attack with the previously noted value. It’s an issue of priority being determined by the nature of the influence over the timing of the influence, i.e., rather than the level-up taking precedence because it was most recent, Chaos Mirror takes precedence because of its nature as an overriding effect.

I’m not aware of an official ruling that specifically deals with this scenario, but similar issues about what takes priority when multiple cards try to modify a value have been ruled on, and this explanation feels consistent to me, though I’m not completely confident about it.

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Thank you, I’m considering this the “official” ruling :slight_smile:

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This is exactly what has led to many arguments about Gargoyle.

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From the balance discussion:

I’m not sure, could someone explain the distinction between sacrifice and trash here?

Sacrifice - card goes to the discard, Trash - removes it from the game.
Edit: Sorry, you mean when referring to Tokens. I can’t see what the difference would be.

For tokens, the only practical differences between sacrifice and trash are that sacrifice triggers death trigger abilities and can be prevented by indestructible, two lives, “can’t be sacrificed”, and Soul Stone, whereas trash does not and can not.

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Oh, so probably the “petty” is about losing patrol-granted on death triggers?

Probably would be more constructive to say that explicitly. @Penatronic was probably not thinking through that detail when he chose that wording, so giving the benefit of the doubt here would be welcome.

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Fair enough.

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I used that wording because that’s what someone else had used when proposing that rule. Since they are tokens it does not impact if they go back to deck or leave the game, but if trashed means you don’t get patrol death benefits I think it would make sense to stay with that version of the nerf. I’m not dying on that hill if other people have a preference or strong opinion.

I think EricF originally proposed it, but I don’t remember if he said trash back then.
I said trash just because it was the easiest way to word it at the time. I’m not hung up on it.

If you use Manufactured Truth to turn a card unit into a Bird, then lose Bird’s Nest on the same turn, the card would be trashed.

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Oh, that does not sound desirable.

To be fair, that interaction could also happen with Hardened Mox, the Ghost from Hero’s Monument, and with Quince’s mid- and maxband. But all those cards require the “trash” wording because they’re indestructible / can copy something indestructible.

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Am I right to assume that this is correct and the unit still has swift strike?

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Yes, that seems to be the consensus.

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Yeah, Ferocity is given to the unit, not the controller.

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Is sparkshot mandatory or can the attacking player decide whether he wants to deal that damage?

The wording is “When attacking a patroller, deals 1 damage to an adjacent patroller.” I don’t see a ‘may’ there, so I’d say it’s mandatory. Same as say Bamstamper Lizzo, unlike say Fairie Dragon.

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