GG WP. I think youāve got a good handle on how to exploit my deckās weak spots now, and I donāt see a way to turn that around, so letās end this pairing here. Thanks for the games, and maybe we can fit in some more between future rounds with a different pairing.
Sounds good. Weāve won all of our P2s evenly split. I think it is a matter of both deck favoring P2. I honestly dont know what your decks weakness is except you dont have a solo bully hero. Was just trying to outpace Present Tech IIs as P2. As P1 it is a tough fight and didnt really find an answer.
Well, my deckās star players are 1/1sā¦ Skeleton, Warp Gate Disciple, Chronofixerā¦ so once you started using Ember Sparks and especially Molting Firebird, it really kept my deck from rolling along as it likes to. But yeah, youāre right, both decks favor P2 because the hasty tech II units mean a chance to rush down the opponentās Tech II before they can deploy. I considered using Skeletal Lord to buff my Skeletons and make them more survivable, but I was worried youād just go for Hotter Fire and then your Firebirds could mow down almost anything I could field.
Thatās an interesting perspecive! Itās very different from how I think of Necro/Present/Discipline. IMO the main things Discipline brings to the table are Rambasa Twins (for maxband shenanigans) and Grave himself.
The semantic question is also interesting (for me at least). I think of āaggressiveā as establishing early board presence, applying pressure, and forcing the opponent to play defensively. So like bansa, I associate it with combat heroes, along with tech 1 units and cheap spells like Lichās Bargain and Birdās Nest. What you call aggressive I tend to think of as āexplosiveā.
Not saying I agree or disagree with the ratings, but hereās how I would argue for them:
Redās haste is less effective against an empty board.
Green is most impactful when it plays Calamandra T1 followed by a spell or two T2.
Blue struggles to hold ground in the early game, so getting to deploy first can helpā¦ also, Blue P1 is more likely to get Inspector before the opponent is ready to build their Tech I.
I agree with Nekoatlās points.
To add, I think having a bully hero like Cal, Oni, Vandy and Grave is what makes a difference.
Starting with Neutral, from my experience Neutral gets pretty even start.
I would still prefer P1 over P2 slightly because it has two 1 drop units but can hold as P2 okay with Bloom in hand.
Red I prefer P2 because I canāt really open with a hero which doesnāt appeal to me as P1. Red needs gold advantage for explosive hasty actions combined with Zane and Drakk.
Green has one 1 drop unit and is the only reason I didnāt put it as strongly favored but Green has no haste which means it needs board to ramp up itās strength. Going first is a big plus.
Blue absolutely prefers P1 big time. Is why I have skewed perspective about P1 vs P2. Blue P1 is strong, thanks to Oni, MT and Arrest are also much more effective as P1. Blue has cheap T1 unit options so have less money is not a huge disadvantage. Blue P2 is just weak. Very weak.
Black I think is well balanced. Strong on both P1 and P2. Is why we see Black starter dominance. Reason why I put it as slightly P2 favored is because STW and Det are great response spells.
White is Iām least confident with. I have little experience with White. I was told and I agree it prefers P1. It may be just favored or slightly favored.
Purple is easy and I think everyone would agree it is a P2 color.
Really good points by both of you! I think this could make for an interesting discussion thread.
Iāll add my pov on White: most of the starter cards really want you to be attacking, which is of course easier as P1 (Safe Attacking, Grappling Hook, Senseiās Advice, Aged Sensei, even Fox Primus and Fox Viper). Thatās also true for Grave, who loves attacking + midbanding early, especially with Hook and Sensei.
Plus youāve got serious threats you can field on T3 which force an answer from your opponent (Birdās Nest, Rambasa Twins, Sparring Partner), and youāre not in any rush to get to tech 2 (with a Heroesā Hall and a maxband or two you can keep up with many tech 2 plans, and two of your Ultimate spells are excellent win cons).
I think itās instructive that almost all of that is inverted for Purple: its starter cards donāt care about attacking (or have haste), many of its tech 1 units are reactive / defensive (Stewardess, Gilded Glaxx, Sentry), and it usually wants to get to tech 2 as fast as possible.
Itās interesting to me, because the usual logic would be that Red is an aggressive faction, therefore P1, and vice versa for Green and Blue as defensive / late-game factions. But then, if you try to play Green or Blue purely defensively until Tech II, you usually just lose. Green especially struggles if you try to establish a board without the help of spells.
Blue has no upgrade removal, which is nice. Hopefully, I can sneak in a Second Chances sooner rather than laterā¦ and with that in mind, it might be a good idea to keep StW and Javelineer around long-term, also, Graveyard needs to go, though not necessarily right away. As for the immediate scenario, letās see if I can provoke Onimaru into buying levels then follow-up to hit him with Doom Grasp.
Tech 2 card(s)
Get Paid - ($6)
Worker - ($5)
Haunt trades with Director
Garth Torken - ($3)
Skeleton - ($2)
Skeleton Javelineer - ($1)
Float ($1)
Discard 3, reshuffle, draw 5
Board Info: In Patrol:
Squad Leader:
Elite:
Scavenger: Skeleton (1/1)
Technician: Skeleton Javelineer (1/1) [javelin]
Lookout:
In Play:
L1 Garth Torken (1/3) Animate
Buildings:
Base HP: 20
Tech I HP: 5
Economy Info: Cards:
Hand: 5
Deck: 4
Disc: 0
Gold:
Gold: 1
Workers: 7
Thoughts
He didnāt build his Tech I, which is nice. But it may also mean that Iām looking at Boot Camp and/or Elite Training. Even so, if he uses Training to sparkshot both Skeletons here, that heavily favors me in terms of value.
Lucky draw; now I donāt have to worry about Art of Warā¦ is what Iād like to say, but for that timely Newsman play. And Stewardess will only help with that if I can play her in the same turn as Doom Grasp. StW would be more effective, but is lower valueā¦ especially if I have to pay the multicolor penalty.
This might be a good time to tech in Second Chances and Temporal Distortion. I wonāt be able to use them right away, but Second Chances synergizes well with Doom Grasp and Temporal Distortion, and Temporal Distortion further synergizes well with Stewardess and Rememberer (which I hope to cheat in via Garthās maxband). Plus, Iām looking at a long cycle, so if I donāt tech them in now, I may get stuck waiting too long for them later. Guess I should tech up now as well; even though I wonāt draw Second Chances or Temporal Distortion next turn, I might want to summon a second hero or, though very unlikely, maxband in a Rememberer. But man, I really hope he didnāt tech in Tax Collectors.
STARTING HAND
Thieving Imp
Graveyard
Sacrifice the Weak
Stewardess of the Undone
Skeletal Archery
WORKERS
Poisonblade Rogue
Jandra, the Negator
Summon Skeletons
Graveyard
NextHand
Doom Grasp
Seer
Deteriorate
Second Chances
Discard
Sacrifice the Weak
Pestering Haunt
Skeletal Archery
Thieving Imp
Tech 2 card(s)
Get Paid + float - ($9)
Worker - ($8)
Javelineer throws javelin to break Tax Collectorās armor
Garth deals 1 damage to Tax Collector
Midband Garth - ($5)
Sacrifice Javelineer to draw (triggers reshuffle)
Sacrifice the Weak kills Reputable Newsman - ($3)
Stewardess of the Undone, undo Soldier (2/2) - ($0)
Pestering Haunt trades with Soldier (2/1)
Float ($0)
Discard 2, draw 4
Board Info: In Patrol:
Squad Leader:
Elite:
Scavenger:
Technician: Stewardess of the Undone (2/3)
Lookout:
In Play:
L4 Garth Torken (2/4) Animate, sacrifice
Buildings:
Base HP: 20
Tech I HP: 5
Tech II HP: 5 (Past)
Economy Info: Cards:
Hand: 4
Deck: 3
Disc: 4
Gold:
Gold: 0
Workers: 9
Thoughts
Booo, Tax Collector! Still worried about Art of War, but other than that, Iām safe for the moment. Iām triggering the reshuffle as early as possible in hopes of drawing higher tech cards more quickly.
Squad Leader:
Elite:
Scavenger:
Technician: Skeleton (1/1)
Lookout:
Base HP: 20