ah, I can see how that might have been misleading - my intention was to offer further evidence that the death never happened rather than just saying “no, Indestructible is to be read this way”
As a note, though, tokens really do hit the discard pile before they disappear. Same for things affected by Second Chances. “Dying = going from play to discard” doesn’t have any exceptions, as far as I’m aware.
Yeah but it’s quite confusive because cards like Reteller of Truths allow to draw from technician whereas Brave Knight don’t.
And tokens never go to discard…
The basic meaning of dying is going from board to discard, but once in discard tokens are trashed and Reteller of Truth goes back to hand 
Ah, Mox doesn’t get patrol bonuses? Hmmmmmm.
Lol, dude, i had the same doubt and asked @EricF who explained to me: the key is in the “instead” wording. BK and indistructibles have “instead of diyng do X” , while reteler says “when they die, return them to hand” 
EDIT: For tokens, they die, go to disc, get trashed. that is why they give u scav/tech bonus. Tokens can exist only in play. As soon as they leave the field they get trashed.
SQL,elite, looky bonuses, yes. TECH/scav, no
If I pay 2 to ready Sparring Partner, can I really only spar with him, or can I do other non-attack things like patrol him?
You just can’t attack with him.
Are you sure about that? I have been assuming that patrollers leave the patrol zone during the Ready phase, which is before Upkeep. So if you pump one of your own units with Vandy, patrol it in tech/scav, and it survives your opponent’s turn, you won’t get a bonus when it dies.
The only thing I see in the rulebook about when patrollers stop patrolling is in the Quick Reference on page 21: “They don’t actually count as patrolling during your turn, only on opponents’ turns.” This would also lend evidence to the idea that you can’t get a tech/scav bonus when one of your units dies to Vandy maxband pump.
hey @sharpobject, does Hotter Fire increase damage from Bloodlust? It seems like it ought to, but Bloodlust is templated differently than most other spells, so maybe it doesn’t?
I think he is referring to if mdn1111’s Vandy had targeted one of my other units instead of the Mox.
there is a misunderstanding. We were talking about opponet’s units 
If my vandy dooms an opponent troop, he can covert it into a card/gold since it will die during my upkeep.
Ok, so is Bloodlust affected by Hotter Fire?
imo no, cuz wording says take, not deal.
The damage is coming from somewhere. The damage is being dealt. It must be dealt by something. The something causing the damage is Bloodlust. Therefore, Bloodlust must be dealing the damage. Therefore, Hotter Fire must combo with Bloodlust in an interesting way.
Now, if there’s a whole weird Codex-only definition of “deal damage” that defines it in such a way that damage can be taken without being dealt, where “deal” and “cause” (or, for that matter, “emit”) are not synonyms, then I guess they don’t mesh. But Sirlin’s always prided himself on his stuff being interpretable as plain English so that he doesn’t have to make big rulebooks, so that seems weird.
Yeah it deals extra damage if you have Hotter Fire
This is misleading, because tokens actually do arrive at whatever zone they are sent to, they just cease to exist if that zone is not “in play”. There is no in between zone between being in play and being in discard, and tokens don’t disappear as they are leaving the in play zone, they disappear when they get to any other zone.
Does Bloodlust end up dealing 2 to both targets, or 2 to one target, and 1 to the other target, under the effects of hotter fire? I am fairly certain it deals 2 to one target and 1 to the other, similar to how ember sparks interacts with hotter fire.
I think Ember Sparks is different because it tells you “you have this much damage to work with; divide it up however you like,” so adding 1 just increases the total damage you have to work with by 1. Bloodlust is saying “Choose 2 things, each of which takes 1 damage at end of turn.” Since they each take a specific amount of damage, each of them gets the +1 effect.
Yes, I think it deals 2 to both, just like Careless Musketeer does, or like Molting Firebird deals 2 to everything.
That is a good point from both of you.