[Casual] FrozenStorm vs zango

Codex Codex play-by-forum
182

One of the things that helped me most with teching was thinking more about what we want in the deck whole-game, and less about the right now / next cycle. There’s a balance to strike there obviously, teching one of GPT/Boulder and one Sharks turn 4 (or 1 MoLaC) would be defensible (you’re hedging I’m going to choose to keep the tech2 down). That doesn’t kill your overall deck composition. But the Guargums were just throwaway. That line’s never going to win against gunships; you need to keep my tech buildings down and stay committed to your growth T2 win con. You’re not gonna have money to out-race Gunships.

GL HF!

Game 7 Player 2 Turn 1

P1 Miracle Grow vs P2 PPA

Starting Hand

Neo Plexus
Plasmodium
Temporal Research
Battle Suits
Fading Argonaut

Events of Turn:

Upkeep:

  • Get Gold (5)
  • Tech 2 cards in (except turn 1)
All Teched Cards

Main:

  • Fading Argonaut (3)
  • Onimaru (1)
  • worker (0)
Workers

Plasmodium

  • :pspurpleshield: Patrol as below
  • Discard 3 Draw 5

Board Info:

Buildings:

  • :heart: Base HP: 20

In Patrol:

  • :psblueshield: Squad Leader: Fading Argonaut (2/3a)
  • :psfist: Elite:
  • :pspig: Scavenger: Oni (2/3 lvl 1)
  • :exhaust: Technician:
  • :target: Lookout:

In Play:

  • nothin

Economy Info:

Cards:

  • Hand: 5
  • Deck: 0
  • Disc: 3

Gold:

  • Gold: 0
  • Workers: 6
End of Turn Hand

Tinkerer
Hardened Mox
Nullcraft
Forgotten Fighter
Time Spiral

End of Turn Discard
My Thoughts

P2 has inside track on their engine in this matchup IMO, I like rushing to Peace engine here. Probably mox next turn still though

1 Like
183

I’ll just drop a relevant (and amusing) section from Sirlin’s overview of the Anarchy spec:

2 Likes
184

Having a tech plan for your deck’s main game plan is a good idea, because it gives you guidelines that you can choose to deviate from.
Most of the time, you can stick to it, and of course you’ll have to change it as necessary, but it provides a stable base when you don’t know what to get.

3 Likes
185

Yeah, I’ve already had read about that in this forum. I guess that’s the difference between knowledge and “knowledge” :wink:
I’ll get there somewhen…

1 Like
186

Game7 P1T2

Tech StartingHand Workers

TECH
Gunpoint Taxman
Bird’s Nest

STARTING HAND
Nautical Dog
Careless Musketeer
Scorch
Pillage
Mad Man

WORKERS
Bloodburn
Scorch

NextHand

Makeshift Rambaster
Bird’s Nest
Gunpoint Taxman
Mad Man
Charge

Tech 2 card(s)
Get Paid + float - ($6)
Worker - ($5)
dog - ($4)
Rook - ($2)
tech 1 - ($0)

Float ($0)
Discard 3, reshuffle, draw 5

Board Info:
In Patrol:

  • :psblueshield: Squad Leader: Bombaster (2/2A)
  • :psfist: Elite:
  • :ps_: Scavenger:
  • :pschip: Technician: Nautical Dog
  • :target: Lookout:

In Play:

  • Rook (2/4, lvl1)

Buildings:

  • :heart: Base HP: 20
  • :heart: Tech I HP: 5

Economy Info:
Cards:

  • Hand: 5
  • Deck: 3
  • Disc: 0

Gold:

  • Gold: 0
  • Workers: 6
Thoughts

After some back and forth I decided to go for Rook with dog. SL Bombaster can easily be killed by battlesuited Fargo without Fargo dying, but then Rook & dog can kill Oni unless he skips worker or tech. So it’s more likely that he goes a route like nullcraft or battlesuit and no attack. I was shortly tempted to go for a tower to discourage this annoying nullcraft, but oviously that is absolute nonsense.

post draw: WOW, let’s see against what I’m up to with this T3 godhand

187

Game 7 Player 2 Turn 2

P1 Miracle Grow vs P2 PPA

Starting Hand

Tinkerer
Hardened Mox
Nullcraft
Forgotten Fighter
Time Spiral

Events of Turn:

Upkeep:

  • Get Gold (6)
  • Tech 2 cards in (except turn 1)
All Teched Cards

Stewardess of the Undone, Overeager Cadet

Main:

  • Oni kills Bombaster
  • Hardened Mox (3)
  • Tech 1 (1)
  • Worker (0)
Workers

Time Spiral, Plasmodium

  • :pspurpleshield: Patrol as below
  • Discard 3 rs Draw 5

Board Info:

Buildings:

  • :heart: Base HP: 20
  • Tech1 HP: 5

In Patrol:

  • :psblueshield: Squad Leader: Fading Argonaut (2/3a fade 2)
  • :psfist: Elite: Hardened Mox (1+1/1)
  • :pspig: Scavenger:
  • :exhaust: Technician:
  • :target: Lookout:

In Play:

  • Oni (2/1 lvl 1)

Economy Info:

Cards:

  • Hand: 5
  • Deck: 3
  • Disc: 0

Gold:

  • Gold: 0
  • Workers: 7
End of Turn Hand

Tinkerer
Battle Suits
Forgotten Fighter
Temporal Research
Overeager Cadet

End of Turn Discard
My Thoughts

Yeah okay, Birds probably coming, non-zero chance that plus charge comes, but that’s fine TBH, I’ll still take the Bombaster kill

188

That’s actually another major learning for me. In your place I never would have used Oni to kill Bombaster as healing Oni seems out of reach and it opens him up to birds, but calculating things through I’m pretty certain you come away as the one benefitting more from “trading” Oni (independent of me having charged birds or not).

Game7 P1T3

Tech StartingHand Workers

TECH
Blooming Ancient
Might of Leaf and Claw

STARTING HAND
Mad Man
Bird’s Nest
Gunpoint Taxman
Charge
Makeshift Rambaster

WORKERS
Bloodburn
Scorch
Makeshift Rambaster

NextHand

Bombaster (2/2A)
Bloodrage Ogre
Pillage
Careless Musketeer

Tech 2 card(s)
Get Paid - ($6)
Worker - ($5)
Bird’s Nest - ($3)
charge on bird1, kills Oni - ($0)

Float ($0)
Discard 2, draw 3, reshuffle, draw 1

Board Info:
In Patrol:

  • :psblueshield: Squad Leader: Nautical Dog (1/1A, frenzy when attacking)
  • :psfist: Elite:
  • :ps_: Scavenger: bird2 (1/1, flying)
  • :pschip: Technician: Rook (2/4, lvl3)
  • :target: Lookout:

In Play:

  • Bird’s Nest
  • bird1 (1/1, flying)

Buildings:

  • :heart: Base HP: 20
  • :heart: Tech I HP: 5

Economy Info:
Cards:

  • Hand: 4
  • Deck: 5
  • Disc: 0

Gold:

  • Gold: 0
  • Workers: 7
Thoughts

My lines:
A
charged birds kill Oni
B
Dog, mad max, rambaster clear the coast for Oni to be killed by Rook + play GPT for defense
C
Play GPT & birds (and maybe mad max)

A: Killing Oni this way leaves a single non flying unit patrolling plus Rook, him having stewardess + battlesuits (or nullcraft if I don’t patrol with second bird in SL) is enough to kill Rook. If he has the combo I invested 5 gold and two cards (only counting gold of charge as birds survive, but counting birds nest+charge for card count) and he will have invested 4 gold and one card (only counting Fargo and hero as invest). Or he can just kill Rook with the help of Zane if he has nullcraft/battle suits.
If he doesn’t have the combo he will probably just kill dog and drop more defense/soon to be offense. At least I will have Bogre available next turn for a part of that, but I’m not really sure whether this whole sternal is the place I want to be in.
B: too many cards for too little gain and I have to worker a card that I would prefer to have in deck instead.
C: if I were him I’d just attack again with oni plus mox to kill GPT. The two levels for Rook don’t get me nowhere and then overall his two gold hero has taken out four gold of mine and two cards. Fargo then also can kill something and probably stewardess can kill something while putting up defense. Does not really sound like the place I want to be in.

So A it is.
As Fargo only has this one last opportunity to attack, it doesn’t matter whether Rook kills him in case he is attacked (except for the timing when Fargo will hit the discard), so I’m putting him in a position where I gain value from him dying.

After revisiting CAMS 21 and seeing Frozen to tech two tech 2 cards on a regular basis in a situation like this, I’m going to try that as well, even though it’s going to be a dead card at least once.

189

Yeah calculated risk you might have Birds + Charge but even if you did, not awful trade

Game 7 Player 2 Turn 3

P1 Miracle Grow vs P2 PPA

Starting Hand

Tinkerer
Battle Suits
Forgotten Fighter
Temporal Research
Overeager Cadet

Events of Turn:

Upkeep:

  • Get Gold (7)
  • Tech 2 cards in (except turn 1)
All Teched Cards

Stewardess of the Undone, Flagstone Garrison
Overeager Cadet x2

Main:

  • Fading Argonaut kills SQL
  • Mox pings Rook
  • Zane + midband, kill Rook, we both draw 1, maxband and shove Tweetie to lookout, Bird’s Nest falls down (2)
  • Overeager Cadet
  • Overeager Cadet
  • Worker (1)
Workers

Forgotten Fighter, Time Spiral, Plasmodium

  • :pspurpleshield: Patrol as below
  • Discard 3 Draw 2 rs Draw 3

Board Info:

Buildings:

  • :heart: Base HP: 20
  • Tech1 HP: 5

In Patrol:

  • :psblueshield: Squad Leader: Overeager Cadet (2+1/2)
  • :psfist: Elite: Overeager Cadet (2+1/2)
  • :pspig: Scavenger:
  • :exhaust: Technician:
  • :target: Lookout:

In Play:

  • Fading Argonaut (2/2 fade 1)
  • Hardened Mox (1/1)
  • Zane (4/4 lvl 6)

Economy Info:

Cards:

  • Hand: 5
  • Deck: 2
  • Disc: 0

Gold:

  • Gold: 1
  • Workers: 8
End of Turn Hand

Nullcraft
Neo Plexus
Tinkerer
Flagstone Garrison
Temporal Research

End of Turn Discard
My Thoughts

Counter-kill with Zane, simple enough, I’ll tech a garrison now and hope it bottom decks. Stewardess as well for the birbs. Should be able to keep threat on tech buildings with that other OC draw, loverly

190

Seriously? Making the same mistake twice really sucks. Was only thinking about Fargo killing Rook, not Zane midband… What a bummer to not have put him in elite :face_with_symbols_over_mouth:
What difference such a small decision just made… Wow…

191

We can mulligan if you want to.

Probably what changes is Zane sits on midband, you keep both birds, and I am lower on cards bc I’d play battle suits for the kill. It’s better for me in some ways to set up my next cycle and keep Zane maxband threat, but better for you overall

192

No way, let me learn from my blunders. Still pondering about what to do.
About your cycle alignment: I’m not getting that one. And the discard 3, rs, draw five also doesn’t add up in my mind. It was discard 3, draw 2, rs, draw 3 right?
With the deck only holding two more cards I don’t see the big difference to you probably referring to a situation where you end your turn without the next reshuffle. With your next cycle almost being over again, that doesn’t feel like a big difference to me, or what am I missing?

1 Like
193

You are correct, I just did dc 3 draw 2 rs draw 3, copy pasta error.

Difference would have been dc2 draw 3 rs draw 1.

How that is helpful is it increases the odds that what I tech ends up in my turn 5 hand. For peace engine setup that means I can get really strong chances of putting garrison + unit of my choice in my turn 5 hand, which is what I want to do. With my current draw, I can’t get the same high odds for a t5 garrison.

Now my current situation is still great, one less bird to worry about, I still have decent chances at the garrison t5, and I have way stronger board position, so I’m in great shape to keep you off tech 2. But I am a little more at the mercy of RNGeezuz for my engine setup

1 Like
194

By the way: your talk about peace engine did not influence my play

Game7 P1T4

Tech StartingHand Workers

TECH
Surprise Attack
Blooming Ancient

STARTING HAND
Careless Musketeer
Bloodrage Ogre
Pillage
Bombaster (2/2A)
Mad Man

WORKERS
Bloodburn
Scorch
Makeshift Rambaster
Careless Musketeer

NextHand

Blooming Ancient
Gunpoint Taxman
Might of Leaf and Claw
Charge
Surprise Attack

Tech 2 card(s)
Get Paid - ($7)
Worker - ($6)
arg - ($4)
tech 2 growth - ($0)
bird pings Zane

Float ($0)
Discard 4, draw 4, reshuffle, draw 1

Board Info:
In Patrol:

  • :psblueshield: Squad Leader: Arg (1/3A)
  • :psfist: Elite:
  • :ps_: Scavenger: wisp (0/1)
  • :pschip: Technician:
  • :target: Lookout:

In Play:

  • bird1 (1/1, flying)

Buildings:

  • :heart: Base HP: 20
  • :heart: Tech I HP: 5
  • :heart: Tech II HP: 5 (Growth)

Economy Info:
Cards:

  • Hand: 5
  • Deck: 7
  • Disc: 0

Gold:

  • Gold: 0
  • Workers: 8
Thoughts

What a major mistake those two were, offering Rook to Zane on the silver platter, allowing him the card draw and sacrificing a bird as well…

Was thinking last turn about teching a chaos mirror, that would come in handy now!

Option A: Bogre+bombaster+2 floating
Option B: Bogre/bombaster+Arg+2 floating
Option C: Bogre+bombaster+Arg
Option D: Bogre+tech 2
Option E: Arg+tech 2
Option F: Arg+tower (not worth considering)

Thoughts on Arg/no Arg: Before arg is relevant for BAs I’ll definitely have time to sacrifice him, but in the meantime he might benefit from that, hero level wise. And as a second hero it’s probably better to have Rook again, but that probably should not be the consideration now. Playing Zane now gains no value so that’s just not an option. So the question: what do I do with signaling I don’t have mirror or sharks in my hand? Probably nothing as Frozen will not be stopped from doing bad things because he is afraid of a single card, that he doesn’t know for sure to be in my hand or even in my deck.

Thoughts on tech rush: well, obviously he will be able to keep the building down for a while, but he has to do so repeatedly which will bind resources, as next turn GPT+Rook at least bring some kind of barrier (or maybe even maxband Rook?).
Option E means he has to have nullcraft or battle suits or stewardess in hand or tech 2 lives, but the probability of that can safely be assumed to be equal to 100%.
For option D Battlesuits plus nullcraft probably is blowout with him then being able to drop both tech 1 AND tech 2, so in this scenario I probably should safe my single bird for patrol duties.

Thinking things through, I kind of fast discounted A and C. When putting Arg in SL, my main concern is: what do I do when he simply refuses to attack? This scenario really got me thinking.

For tech rush: defending with arg most definitely leaves every single attacking unit alive, but at least open to be killed by bird/mad max at a later point. Offering wisp in scavenger threatens maxbanding Rook next turn, so it’s more likely that in case he holds stewardess that he let’s my bird live. That Rook option is what made the point for arg, even though then obviously tech 2 growths just isn’t such a big threat anymore.

Going to tech sharks or mirror for building up pressure at some point in case I’m not able to hold tech 2, but I think I have to tech in BA as I need to have a tech 2 card in hand in case the building suddenly stays alive somewhen.

195

Kinda impossible for it to not, but not worried about it either way :wink:

Game 7 Player 2 Turn 4

P1 Miracle Grow vs P2 PPA

Starting Hand

Nullcraft
Neo Plexus
Tinkerer
Flagstone Garrison
Temporal Research

Events of Turn:

Upkeep:

  • Get Gold (8+1float)
  • Tech 2 cards in (except turn 1)
All Teched Cards

Flagstone Garrison, Calypso Vystari
Stewardess of the Undone, Flagstone Garrison
Overeager Cadet x2

Main:

  • Cadets kill Arg, levels fizzle
  • Mox kills Wisp, you get 1g
  • Nullcraft, it and Zane break the tech2, your base to 18 (7)
  • Neo Plexus (5)
  • Worker (4)
  • Tech2 Peace (0)
Workers

Tinkerer, Forgotten Fighter, Time Spiral, Plasmodium

  • :pspurpleshield: Patrol as below
  • Discard 2 Draw 2 rs Draw 2

Board Info:

Buildings:

  • :heart: Base HP: 20
  • Tech1 HP: 5
  • Tech2 HP: 5 PEACE

In Patrol:

  • :psblueshield: Squad Leader:
  • :psfist: Elite:
  • :pspig: Scavenger:
  • :exhaust: Technician: Neo Plexus (2/2)
  • :target: Lookout:

In Play:

  • Hardened Mox (1/1)
  • Zane (4/3 lvl 6)
  • Nullcraft (1/1)
  • Overeager Cadet (2/1)
  • Overeager Cadet (2/1)

Economy Info:

Cards:

  • Hand: 4
  • Deck: 3
  • Disc: 0

Gold:

  • Gold: 0
  • Workers: 9
End of Turn Hand

Stewardess of the Undone
Battle Suits
Calypso Vystari
Flagstone Garrison

End of Turn Discard
My Thoughts

Peace engine should be doable here, unless there’s sharks I’ll be fine, and even if there is we’ll be able to fight it back

196

What would you have done with that in this situation?
STARTING HAND
Careless Musketeer
Bloodrage Ogre
Pillage
Bombaster (2/2A)
Mad Man

197

I’m just teasing :sweat_smile:, arg + tech up is a solid move there. I just meant it’s likely to influence your tech choices, though pretty minimally

198

Frozen is notorious for forgetting to update his end of turn discard draw numbers, but the counts at the bottom are usually correct.

2 Likes
199

Lol, do I sense some tension here? If so:
@Bryce_The_Rice ROFL
@FrozenStorm no offense taken and I hope I had no aggressive subtext, please continue to tease if that’s possible appropriately :wink:

1 Like
200

No tension, all good XD

3 Likes
201

Hah no, I have nothing but respect for my man. It’s just very common :stuck_out_tongue:

3 Likes