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Yomi and Smash Bros

I find myself getting worse at Yomi as I get better at Smash Bros. I feel the two games are trying to make you learn two completly opposing skills.

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IME Smash tends to reward doing a lot of things quickly in a way that Yomi and traditional fighters don’t. They reward doing only the moves that are going to count. It’s a difference in mindset

Yomi is kinda like if a fighting game was in bullet time. Of course in a normal fighting game, especially one as fast as smash, you can’t consistently pick apart every single exchange, but you still need to be able to guess mixups and predict behaviour.

One thing that’s definitely the same is how well you can quickly recognise a play style, and actively changing your own play style in the moment before it’s too late. It’s honestly the thing I admired the most about that one Zane dude who dominated years ago (Raziek?)

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Yomi helped me get better at Oki in traditional 2D fighters. I now realize I’m a grappler player XD.

But to be fair I think most of Yomi’s skillset teaches different things like resource management and being aware of options. The way this tuff translates varies from fighter to fighter and game to game.

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That makes a certain amount of sense considering Yomi was probably most influenced by street fighter. Smash in particular seems so instinctual that Yomi’s lessons are most applicable during review and practice.

To elaborate on my Raziek bit since I was writing that on my lunch break: I was struck primarily by his live commentary in some of his videos where it seemed he was carefully adjusting his range several times per game. At the time I first saw that I was mostly running on instinct with deliberate adjustment once in a while. Memory probably makes this fonder, but since then the frequency illusion kicked in and I started to see adaptability everywhere. Turns out, being able to spot something, discern a good solution, actually take action, do all of that quickly enough to effect the current situation, and rinse repeat as necessary is really freakin hard. It’s also really freakin powerful and applies broadly.

I don’t know if Yomi actually teaches any of that though. It’s a tool that did me well in some ways, but I think I gleaned most things from the community instead.

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Wow these are all great replies! Its hard for me to put into the words, but i feel like ive learned a lot. Maybe YOMI just needs some mechanics to “speed it up” thn it’ll feel like Smash. hmm…

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I’ve seen people training differently in fighting games. Some people like to go analytical, studying frame data, comparing the risks and rewards of different options, etc. They of course can’t anticipate all real games situations, especially in games with as many characters as in smash ultimate. Some people prefer to rely on their reflexes and just practice a lot without thinking out of their boxes. I think that Yomi can bring something to these last people, as in yomi you’ve not only to think about what you and your opponent can do and is the most efficient but also how to avoid being predictable and how to set up mixups. But yeah overthinking in smash can just make you loose some reflexes… IMO it’s good to overthink about the game in some training sessions, but in tournament you just have to manage your stress and to execute what you’ve drilled thousands of times.
Have you ever read the excellent Playing to Win book from Sirlin ? It’s really accurate and well written.
I also enjoyed watching some Sirlin’s Street Fighter tournament games. He’s a really terrifying player, he used to get really high at EVO.
I personnally don’t have fun in competitive reflex-based games. It’s an huge investment of time and reflexes drop down with getting older. I have much more fun playing card games, boardgames and miniature games. At least if you stop practicing one month or two you don’t loose all your skills.
And you won’t loose against a player who make use of doping.

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